Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Discussion and information relevant to creating special missions, new ships, skins etc.

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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by cim »

Redspear wrote:e.g. Can 'unused' be set as a role?
Yes, and if someone does system.addShips("unused",1), you'll get one of them. If you just don't want them to appear, then roles="shuttle(0)" is safer.

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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by Zireael »

I love your Neolite tweak, Redspear!

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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by mossfoot »

I like the idea for those Neolite name and stat tweaks! I might use it and modify the names for a more consistent sounding pantheon, though. I'm thinking birds of prey (or large birds for cargo ships) as an analog to snakes, but with a few New Zealand birds out of respect for SimonB) .

Ooniverse-fiction wise the idea could be that they were developed in one of the more distant universe settings (7 or 8 ) and took on similarities as a means to compete (look at the way USA/Russian fighters co-evolved during and after the cold war, for example - some filled similar roles while others actually looked similar to one another)

Suggested generic bird related list (Edited - Note that some of these names are already used by Elite 2/3 ships. This is intended as a one-stop shopping solution for a parallel pantheon that co-exists alongside the snake-based series, for those who don't intend to fill every possible ship in their Ooniverse ;) )

Adder - Hobby (small bird of prey)
Anaconda - Albatross (not a bird of prey, but found in NZ and large)
Asp - Hawk
Boa - Moa (large and extinct NZ bird)
Cobra3 - Martial Eagle
Cobra1 - Eagle
Constrictor - Raptor (since it's that top secret ship, and birds of prey are also called raptors)
Ferdelance - Harrier
Gecko - Vulture
Krait - Kite
Mamba - Kestrel
Moray - Osprey
Python - Kakapo (large flightless NZ bird... slow. just to round out the cargo ships as large birds ;) )
Shuttle - Sparrow (Sparrow Lifting Surface and Sparrow Lander depending)
Sidewinder - Buzzard
Viper - Falcon
Viper Interceptor - Black Falcon
Last edited by mossfoot on Sun Jul 06, 2014 4:45 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by Redspear »

Thargoid wrote:
Redspear wrote:I haven't touched the Thargoids.
I should hope not! :twisted:
I wouldn't dare :mrgreen:
cim wrote:
Redspear wrote:e.g. Can 'unused' be set as a role?
Yes, and if someone does system.addShips("unused",1), you'll get one of them. If you just don't want them to appear, then roles="shuttle(0)" is safer.
Ah, so 'unused' is a name, not a property and I may as well have assigned them the role 'Bert' or 'Gertrude'. It's the value of (0) that prevents them appearing.
Thanks.
Zireael wrote:I love your Neolite tweak, Redspear!
Thanks Zireael :D
mossfoot wrote:I like the idea for those Neolite name and stat tweaks! I might use it and modify the names for a more consistent sounding pantheon, though. I'm thinking birds of prey (or large birds for cargo ships) as an analog to snakes, but with a few New Zealand birds out of respect for SimonB) .
Cool 8)

It's easy enough to personalise and the names in particular require very little programming skill to change.

Mossfoot, you may wish to consider Haast's Eagle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haast%27s_eagle after which I named(/renamed) the Neolite Asp https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poukai (although you've kind of got that covered with your cobras...)

I've attached condition scripts to mine so that they are only available on planets with particular inhabitants (e.g Crab only available on lobster worlds, Caecelian on frog planets, Moa only on Bird habitations etc.) thus my choice of a varied naming 'scheme'.

If you come up with any more name ideas then please let us know :)

Thanks.
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by mossfoot »

Redspear wrote:
mossfoot wrote:I like the idea for those Neolite name and stat tweaks! I might use it and modify the names for a more consistent sounding pantheon, though. I'm thinking birds of prey (or large birds for cargo ships) as an analog to snakes, but with a few New Zealand birds out of respect for SimonB) .
Cool 8)

It's easy enough to personalise and the names in particular require very little programming skill to change.

Mossfoot, you may wish to consider Haast's Eagle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haast%27s_eagle after which I named(/renamed) the Neolite Asp https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poukai (although you've kind of got that covered with your cobras...)

I've attached condition scripts to mine so that they are only available on planets with particular inhabitants (e.g Crab only available on lobster worlds, Caecelian on frog planets, Moa only on Bird habitations etc.) thus my choice of a varied naming 'scheme'.

If you come up with any more name ideas then please let us know :)

Thanks.
Haast's Eagle would have been good but just doesn't sound right since unless you know the species it sounds like Haast is the guy who designed the Eagle ship ;) . I also wanted them to be mostly generic sounding the same way the stock ships are (when I first bought Elite the only ship that threw me was the Fer De Lance, which I didn't recognize as a snake and thought was some kind of french sailing vessel ;) ).

Also you might notice I tried to match up names with their stock counter parts either sounding similar (Krait, Kite - Boa, Moa) or appropriate ability compared to role (ie Gecko - Buzzard since it's mostly a pirate ship - Sidewinders - Vultures too, but since they are also escort, you can picture them circling around waiting for an opportunity ;) ).

I chose Martial Eagle because the name gets across that it's a more badass version of the Eagle suitable for military engagements (and it is a real life badass Eagle as well). I might actually move some of the names around (swap Kestrel and Hawk, I think) But overall I just thought it was a good match up.

I assume the script you included didn't have such limitations on location availability? I haven't had a chance to see them in-game to see how well the script provided works, but am looking forward to it.

Let me know if you update the script again.
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by Redspear »

mossfoot wrote:Haast's Eagle would have been good but just doesn't sound right since unless you know the species it sounds like Haast is the guy who designed the Eagle ship ;) .
True, that's why I plumped for its legendary name.
mossfoot wrote:I also wanted them to be mostly generic sounding the same way the stock ships are (when I first bought Elite the only ship that threw me was the Fer De Lance, which I didn't recognize as a snake and thought was some kind of french sailing vessel ;) ).
:lol: That was the first time I'd heard of an FdL too (and a Krait come to think of it).
Yeah, those names are more generic. some of mine are a bit obscure...
mossfoot wrote:Also you might notice I tried to match up names with their stock counter parts either sounding similar (Krait, Kite - Boa, Moa) or appropriate ability compared to role (ie Gecko - Buzzard since it's mostly a pirate ship - Sidewinders - Vultures too, but since they are also escort, you can picture them circling around waiting for an opportunity ;) ).
In that case might sidewinders be a bit small to be vultures?... Just a thought.
I like the Boa/Moa switch :D
mossfoot wrote:I chose Martial Eagle because the name gets across that it's a more badass version of the Eagle suitable for military engagements (and it is a real life badass Eagle as well).
Yeah, that works.
mossfoot wrote:I assume the script you included didn't have such limitations on location availability? I haven't had a chance to see them in-game to see how well the script provided works, but am looking forward to it.
I think there might be some confusion here...
All I posted above was the contents of a shipdata-overrides file. No script was included (that's on my computer). So if you just replace the names I added with the ones you like then it should work for you with no location limitations. If you need any help with it then just ask.

Anyway, I'm glad it caught your interest and thanks for your ideas :)
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by mossfoot »

Redspear wrote:
mossfoot wrote:Also you might notice I tried to match up names with their stock counter parts either sounding similar (Krait, Kite - Boa, Moa) or appropriate ability compared to role (ie Gecko - Buzzard since it's mostly a pirate ship - Sidewinders - Vultures too, but since they are also escort, you can picture them circling around waiting for an opportunity ;) ).
In that case might sidewinders be a bit small to be vultures?... Just a thought.
I like the Boa/Moa switch :D
Ah, Yeah, switch the Vulture and Buzzard (Buzzards are smaller, Vultures sound more perfect for a pirate-only ship). I'll update my list with what I think is appropriate, just in case others like the idea. Added "Sparrows" for various shuttles (lander and winged)

I like depth, but I also like things kept simple. The idea of having two distinct sets of similar ships separated in this fashion really appeals to me (as opposed to having a dozen completely different ships with completely different names with no theme at all).
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by mossfoot »

Just confirming the renaming seems to have worked fine. Flew to a high tech system and saw most for sale with the new names.

I take it these also get rotated around for random encounters?
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by Redspear »

mossfoot wrote:I'll update my list with what I think is appropriate, just in case others like the idea.
Folks may wish to consider that some of the names you currently suggest are used by other oxps for different ships (e.g. eagle, falcon, kestrel, osprey). However, they're all very fine names IMO so this may or may not be a problem.
As far as I'm aware Crow and Raven are both currently unused, two birds that are dripping with mythology, and Shrike has come up a few times as a suggestion.
mossfoot wrote:Just confirming the renaming seems to have worked fine. Flew to a high tech system and saw most for sale with the new names.

I take it these also get rotated around for random encounters?
Thanks for the test and confirmation :)

In terms of encounters, I haven't altered the encounter chance included in the Neolites Addition shipdata.plist. So encounter rates should be the same as if you had the Neolites installed alongside the default ship set (i.e. roughly equal chance of a ship from either set appearing). Of course, if you have the Neolites Replace set installed then the default ships will not appear but then my tweak above shouldn't work in that environment.

I'm not convinced that I've answered your question there mossfoot :? If not, you may need to spell it out for me :lol:

Thanks.
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by mossfoot »

Redspear wrote:
mossfoot wrote:I'll update my list with what I think is appropriate, just in case others like the idea.
Folks may wish to consider that some of the names you currently suggest are used by other oxps for different ships (e.g. eagle, falcon, kestrel, osprey). However, they're all very fine names IMO so this may or may not be a problem.
As far as I'm aware Crow and Raven are both currently unused, two birds that are dripping with mythology, and Shrike has come up a few times as a suggestion.
mossfoot wrote:Just confirming the renaming seems to have worked fine. Flew to a high tech system and saw most for sale with the new names.

I take it these also get rotated around for random encounters?
Thanks for the test and confirmation :)

In terms of encounters, I haven't altered the encounter chance included in the Neolites Addition shipdata.plist. So encounter rates should be the same as if you had the Neolites installed alongside the default ship set (i.e. roughly equal chance of a ship from either set appearing). Of course, if you have the Neolites Replace set installed then the default ships will not appear but then my tweak above shouldn't work in that environment.

I'm not convinced that I've answered your question there mossfoot :? If not, you may need to spell it out for me :lol:

Thanks.
No it answers it fine. But if you are right that some of those names are used elsewhere. I guess that list should have a disclaimer as being a replacement ship-set name for those who don't intend to include Elite2/3 ships (that's where those other ones are used, if I'm not mistaken). And, let's face it, I doubt THAT many people are going to be interested in this little thing ;) But I do think it's a creative way to make better use of the Neolite ships, so good job thinking of it.
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by Redspear »

mossfoot wrote:And, let's face it, I doubt THAT many people are going to be interested in this little thing ;) But I do think it's a creative way to make better use of the Neolite ships, so good job thinking of it.
True :lol:

...and thanks.
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by Diziet Sma »

mossfoot wrote:
Redspear wrote:some of the names you currently suggest are used by other oxps for different ships (e.g. eagle, falcon, kestrel, osprey).
I guess that list should have a disclaimer as being a replacement ship-set name for those who don't intend to include Elite2/3 ships (that's where those other ones are used, if I'm not mistaken).
Well, in Oolite at least, the Kestrel & Falcon aren't the Frontier ships by those names.. they're Star Wars ships.. :wink: :mrgreen:
(I'm very fond of my Falcon-S, btw.. excellent smuggler's ship)
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by Diziet Sma »

The audio effects in BGS are something I really like.. the atmosphere they help create is a big plus in the immersion stakes, IMO.

But there was one thing that just never seemed right. Whilst you can hear plenty of female voices when docked, the comms chatter in the Station Aegis is very testosterone-heavy.

Where were all the female commanders? The female traffic controllers?

It bugged me for a long time, but yesterday I finally located yet another round tuit (I've found a few of those, lately!) and did something about it..

Locating suitable free audio samples wasn't hard (once you know the secret of how the chatter was originally sourced and created, anyway), so I got hold of a bunch of audio and extracted some suitable clips. I winnowed this collection of some 50 clips down to choose the best 16 samples, to match the 16 male clips in BGS, and cleaned up the clicks and pops in the audio. Like the male voices, there's a similar mix of short, medium and long clips, so it balances out quite nicely.

Then came the matter of adding them to BGS. There are two relevant files that need tweaking: Config/customsounds.plist and Scripts/BGS-M.js

In customsounds.plist, we need to add 16 extra lines immediately after line #107, to reference the additional sound files:

Code: Select all

	"[bgs_fxChatterG]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter10.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterH]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter11.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterI]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter12.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterJ]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter13.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterK]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter14.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterL]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter15.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterM]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter16.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterN]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter17.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterO]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter18.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterP]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter19.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterQ]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter1A.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterR]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter1B.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterS]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter1C.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterT]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter1D.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterU]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter1E.ogg";
	"[bgs_fxChatterV]" = "bgs-m_ambi_chatter1F.ogg";
In BGS-M.js, we need to reference those same files again, in lines #50-51, extending them out to lines #52-53 as well:

Code: Select all

	this.chatterPool = ["[bgs_fxChatter0]","[bgs_fxChatter1]","[bgs_fxChatter2]","[bgs_fxChatter3]","[bgs_fxChatter4]","[bgs_fxChatter5]","[bgs_fxChatter6]","[bgs_fxChatter7]",
		"[bgs_fxChatter8]","[bgs_fxChatter9]","[bgs_fxChatterA]","[bgs_fxChatterB]","[bgs_fxChatterC]","[bgs_fxChatterD]","[bgs_fxChatterE]","[bgs_fxChatterF]","[bgs_fxChatterG]",
		"[bgs_fxChatterH]","[bgs_fxChatterI]","[bgs_fxChatterJ]","[bgs_fxChatterK]","[bgs_fxChatterL]","[bgs_fxChatterM]","[bgs_fxChatterN]","[bgs_fxChatterO]","[bgs_fxChatterP]",
		"[bgs_fxChatterQ]","[bgs_fxChatterR]","[bgs_fxChatterS]","[bgs_fxChatterT]","[bgs_fxChatterU]","[bgs_fxChatterV]"];
The end result can be used as an OXP, or, if you know how (again, not hard) re-bundled into an OXZ.

I've been testing it out since yesterday, and it makes a considerable difference in-game. Not only does it feel more realistic, but the chatter is now less repetitious, and the interactions that ensue can be quite entertaining, at times. I do recommend, though, that you use OXPConfig to set chatter to use longer pauses.

I've bundled up the audio and files into a patch, which can simply be copied into your BGS expansion pack. You will be asked if you wish to merge the Sounds folders, and if you wish to replace Config/customsounds.plist and Scripts/BGS-M.js. Just answer <Yes/Ok> to all.

It can be downloaded here:
BGS - Female Commanders and Controllers.zip
(Note: this patch is for BGS 1.9 - not guaranteed to work with earlier versions, unless you tweak the above files yourself)
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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by Norby »

Diziet Sma wrote:re-bundled into an OXZ
Done in [EliteWiki] BGS-A1.9.1. Nice work Diziet! :)

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Re: Tinkerer's Workshop - OXP tweaking for fun and profit!

Post by Diziet Sma »

Norby wrote:
Diziet Sma wrote:re-bundled into an OXZ
Done in [EliteWiki] BGS-A1.9.1. Nice work Diziet! :)
Thank you! :D I had a feeling you might do that.. was going to suggest it to you, in fact.
Most games have some sort of paddling-pool-and-water-wings beginning to ease you in: Oolite takes the rather more Darwinian approach of heaving you straight into the ocean, often with a brick or two in your pockets for luck. ~ Disembodied

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