Docking fees revisited

Discussion and information relevant to creating special missions, new ships, skins etc.

Moderators: winston, another_commander

Layne
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 355
Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 11:14 pm

Docking fees revisited

Post by Layne » Tue Apr 21, 2015 2:28 pm

A long time ago (almost a decade, from the looks of things!) there was some talk about adding docking fees to stations. See this thread for more: http://www.aegidian.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=2740

Anyhow, I can't find any evidence that it ever went further than a few suggestions and never seems to have been implemented either in the furs.oxp mentioned or anywhere else. Has this ever been an oxp feature? Is there anyone who's added docking fees to Oolite in any form?
Reports of my death have been greatly underestimated.

User avatar
pagroove
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 3033
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 11:52 pm
Location: On a famous planet

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by pagroove » Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:30 pm

As far as I know this was never implemented. Could be interesting/and or annoying. :D
For P.A. Groove's music check
https://soundcloud.com/p-a-groove
Famous Planets v 2.7. (for Povray)
Image
http://aegidian.org/bb/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=13709

User avatar
fronclynne
Deadly
Deadly
Posts: 149
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 5:36 am
Location: ::1

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by fronclynne » Wed Apr 22, 2015 10:44 pm

If it's a tiny fee, it's hardly worth doing because once you have a few tens of thousands in the bank it doesn't make any difference. I guess you can mentally amortize ship repairs & pretend that's a docking fee.

If it's a large fee, it'll really kill those new Jamesons just trying to make a few credits to get going. I mean, you only get pait 2 or 3 credits/ton for hauling food 6.8 lightyears! Do you have any idea what that is per ton mile? Yeah, now I have to pay more than I made just to dock & sell it? Just no.

Pay a % of your bank account every time you dock? Oh, Lord. I can only imagine who might think that would be a good idea.

User avatar
Vincentz
Deadly
Deadly
Posts: 174
Joined: Sun Mar 22, 2015 11:26 pm

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by Vincentz » Wed Apr 22, 2015 10:57 pm

fronclynne wrote:If it's a tiny fee, it's hardly worth doing because once you have a few tens of thousands in the bank it doesn't make any difference. I guess you can mentally amortize ship repairs & pretend that's a docking fee.

If it's a large fee, it'll really kill those new Jamesons just trying to make a few credits to get going. I mean, you only get pait 2 or 3 credits/ton for hauling food 6.8 lightyears! Do you have any idea what that is per ton mile? Yeah, now I have to pay more than I made just to dock & sell it? Just no.

Pay a % of your bank account every time you dock? Oh, Lord. I can only imagine who might think that would be a good idea.
This.

Though it could be ok with a small fee... for immersion. 5-10 credits or something.
"There is a single light of science, and to brighten it anywhere is to brighten it everywhere." - Isaac Asimov

Layne
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 355
Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 11:14 pm

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by Layne » Thu Apr 23, 2015 12:21 am

Vincentz wrote: Though it could be ok with a small fee... for immersion. 5-10 credits or something.
This is exactly right, it's immersion. Everything that adds a touch more realism to the world makes things a bit more interesting, and I never begrudged the small docking fees in Frontier, and as has been pointed out, even some of the earlier versions of original Elite had docking fees.
Reports of my death have been greatly underestimated.

User avatar
Wildeblood
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 2161
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2011 6:07 am
Location: Western Australia
Contact:

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by Wildeblood » Thu Apr 23, 2015 12:59 am

Code: Select all

// oolite.oxp.Layne.DockingFees

this.name = "Docking Fees";
this.version = "1.0";

this.shipDockedWithStation = function () {
    player.credits -= (player.credits * 0.05);
}
There you go. Let us know how you enjoy it.
Last edited by Wildeblood on Thu Apr 23, 2015 2:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

Layne
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 355
Joined: Sat Mar 28, 2015 11:14 pm

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by Layne » Thu Apr 23, 2015 1:35 am

Wildeblood wrote:

Code: Select all

// oolite.oxp.Layne.DockingFees

this.name = "Docking Fees";
this.version = "1.0";

this.shipDockedWithStation = function () {
    player.credits -= (payer.credits * 0.05);
}
There you go. Let us know how you enjoy it.

Having corrected your typo in the code, and amended it to a fixed fee based on system tech level (at 1/2 the tech level plus .5 credits) and not an outrageously high percentage, and added a console message to welcome commanders and say a small fee has been deducted, I like it very much in-deed.

Code: Select all

// oolite.oxp.Layne.DockingFees

this.name = "Docking Fees";
this.version = "1.0";

this.shipDockedWithStation = function () {
    player.credits -= (system.techLevel * 0.5 + 0.5),
    player.consoleMessage("Welcome Commander! A docking fee of " + (system.techLevel * 0.5 + 0.5) + " credits has been deducted.", 7);
}
Tested and seems to work in 1.80.
Last edited by Layne on Thu Apr 23, 2015 2:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reports of my death have been greatly underestimated.

User avatar
Wildeblood
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 2161
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2011 6:07 am
Location: Western Australia
Contact:

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by Wildeblood » Thu Apr 23, 2015 2:09 am

Layne wrote:Having corrected your typo in the code...
Oops, unintentional that was.

User avatar
phkb
Commodore
Commodore
Posts: 2403
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 10:37 pm
Location: [p]laying [h]ard and [k]icking [b]utt somewhere in G7...

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by phkb » Thu Apr 23, 2015 6:59 am

I love this idea!

A couple of suggestions in the following code. (1) Check the player credit balance before deducting something. If the player doesn't have enough to cover the fee we can assume that the station has a lenient attitude to taking the fee. (2) Have some variation in the fee at different stations. I've put a few in, but there are probably others that could be included, and what happens to the fee can be adjusted as well.

You could also change the voice of the station by storing different message texts in a descriptions.plist file. That way, a mining outpost can sound different to a rockhermit or a space bar.

Code: Select all

// oolite.oxp.Layne.DockingFees

this.name = "Docking Fees";
this.version = "1.0";

this.shipDockedWithStation = function (station) {
    
    // work out fee based on system tech level and station type
    // default for galcop stations (and any other station that is not covered in the examples below
    var fee = (system.techLevel * 0.5 + 0.5);
    if (station.hasRole("rockhermit")) fee = 0; // rockhermits are free
    if (station.hasRole("constore")) fee *= 2; // con stores are a bit more expensive
    if (station.hasRole("random_hits_any_spacebar")) fee *= 1.5; // space bars are a little bit more expensive
    if (station.hasRole("rrs_group_spacestation")) fee = 0; // rescue stations are free
    if (station.hasRole("casinoship")) fee *= 2; // casinos are a bit more expensive
    if (station.hasRole("wildShips_kiota")) fee *= 1.5; // kiota ships are a little bit more expensive
    if (station.hasRole("rrs-mining-outpost")) fee = 0; // mining outposts are free
    if (station.hasRole("smivs_pizza_giftshop")) fee = 0; // space-pizza gift shop charges a fee of its own    

    // make sure the player has enough credits
    if (fee > 0) {
        if (player.credits > fee) {
            player.credits -= fee;
            player.consoleMessage("Welcome Commander! A docking fee of " + fee + " credits has been deducted.", 7);
        } else {
            player.consoleMessage("Welcome Commander! We've waived the docking fee this time.", 7);
        }
    } 
}
Edit: Corrected a couple of errors in the code (one highlighted by Wildeblood, the other a missing comment marker).
Last edited by phkb on Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:46 am, edited 3 times in total.

User avatar
Smivs
Retired Assassin
Retired Assassin
Posts: 8408
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 11:31 am
Location: Disunited Kingdom
Contact:

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by Smivs » Thu Apr 23, 2015 7:53 am

You already get charged an entrance fee if you visit a Giant Space Pizza visitor centre. :)
Commander Smivs, the friendliest Gourd this side of Riedquat.

User avatar
phkb
Commodore
Commodore
Posts: 2403
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 10:37 pm
Location: [p]laying [h]ard and [k]icking [b]utt somewhere in G7...

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by phkb » Thu Apr 23, 2015 8:20 am

Edited post to add space pizza option.

ralph_hh
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 297
Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 12:42 pm
Location: Germany

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by ralph_hh » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:22 am

The point remains unsolved: If I own a Million, what should docking fees of 7 credits be good for?
100Cr. would be sensible, but joung Jamesons can not afford it.

Oolite Economy is a stupid thing. In reality, you would be raised on the planet, get your pocket money as a child, later with your first joy you get some real money. The expenses grow with the income, so does your understanding, how the money business works. Imagine a potential pilot. He would raise a fortune of 100.000 Cr. to pay for a beginners ship. I would imagine, that by the time he was able to earn that much, he knows a lot more about economy. He would add up to his resources until he owns 150.000Cr, to be able to a) equip his ship with some cheap but important gadgets and b) earn money by traing. No one sensible would start a trading career with just 1000Cr in the purse, just to learn that he is not able to buy vital thinks like an injector no be able to earn any money.

This said, I would not miss the early phase of the game.

User avatar
Wildeblood
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 2161
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2011 6:07 am
Location: Western Australia
Contact:

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by Wildeblood » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:37 am

ralph_hh wrote:The point remains unsolved: If I own a Million, what should docking fees of 7 credits be good for?
100Cr. would be sensible, but joung Jamesons can not afford it.
Which is why I suggested a 5% wealth tax, rather than a fixed fee.

User avatar
Wildeblood
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 2161
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2011 6:07 am
Location: Western Australia
Contact:

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by Wildeblood » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:40 am

phkb wrote:

Code: Select all

this.shipDockedWithStation = function () {
    
    var station = player.ship.dockedStation;
    ...
    } 
WTH?

Code: Select all

this.shipDockedWithStation = function (station) {
    ...
    } 

User avatar
Smivs
Retired Assassin
Retired Assassin
Posts: 8408
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 11:31 am
Location: Disunited Kingdom
Contact:

Re: Docking fees revisited

Post by Smivs » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:49 am

phkb wrote:Edited post to add space pizza option.
Thanks - it's a rip-off anyway without extra charges :P
On a general point some mission stations would probably not charge a fee either, so I think your approach of actively listing stations is a better one than a broad brush 'charge everywhere' fee.
I do like this idea, BTW. It won't be a money-sink (which is something the game needs for established Commanders), but will certainly add some ambience. Good work. :)
Commander Smivs, the friendliest Gourd this side of Riedquat.

Post Reply