Tone down of fuel injectors?

An area for discussing new ideas and additions to Oolite.

Moderators: another_commander, winston

User avatar
drew
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 2186
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 9:29 am
Location: In front of a laptop writing a book.
Contact:

Tone down of fuel injectors?

Post by drew »

Just thinking about this earlier on. I'd like to suggest the slight tone down of fuel injectors.

As a boost technology I wonder if they should only be able to work at full throttle, rather like nitrous oxide injection in cars. If you open your no2 nozzles at less than fuel throttle it's goodbye engine. This is normally prevented automatically in cars.

In Oolite this could be represented by only allowing fuel injection if you're currently at max throttle. If you are at anything else you will need to accelerate first, and then use the injectors, forcing a slight delay and a change of tactics mid fight. Making the injectors less of a 'dodge' and giving missiles a reason to exist.

Currently firing the injectors accelerates you to full speed automatically and the engine speed gauge seems to go to 'full' immediately, rather than accelerating first on normal drives and then triggering injectors.

It could be a bit like 'turbo lag' in operation, taking a moment to 'spin up' to full speed before going into overdrive. I think it would be a little more 'realistic'.

Thoughts? I've always found the injectors a bit 'uber'.

Cheers,

Drew.
Author of the Oolite Saga, the officially licensed Elite: Reclamation and Elite Dangerous: Premonition
WebsiteFacebookTwitter

User avatar
jonnycuba
Deadly
Deadly
Posts: 233
Joined: Fri May 21, 2004 1:04 pm
Location: Witchspace

Re: Tone down of fuel injectors?

Post by jonnycuba »

drew wrote: Thoughts? I've always found the injectors a bit 'uber'.
The injectors were AFAICR implemented after sustained complaint that Oolite was too slow especially in the space lane, even though Oolite has had significant hikes in speed since then. They have (for me at any rate) become a welcome and natural feeling addition to the game and have the built in limitation of fuel for the sake of balance.

Having said that your full throttle idea has appeal...
Team Zorg are Go!

User avatar
drew
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 2186
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 9:29 am
Location: In front of a laptop writing a book.
Contact:

Post by drew »

My suggestion shouldn't affect any movement in the spacelane, it would just make you less smug in a fight since your injectors wouldn't instantly grant you immunity the moment you see a hardened missile bearing down on you.

I see missiles as virtually obsolete with injectors in the frame.

It ought to highten the drama in a battle a little, with the 'boost' taking about a second or so to 'trigger'.

Cheers,

Drew.
Author of the Oolite Saga, the officially licensed Elite: Reclamation and Elite Dangerous: Premonition
WebsiteFacebookTwitter

User avatar
ramon
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 346
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 2:38 pm
Location: Tavistock
Contact:

Post by ramon »

I've got a Hamadryad at the moment - so the fuel injectors getting me to full speed quickly doesn't make me smug, it makes me glad to stay alive when I realise I've bitten off more than I can chew taking on 5 pirates.

User avatar
Odo987
Dangerous
Dangerous
Posts: 121
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 3:56 am
Location: San Francisco
Contact:

Post by Odo987 »

drew wrote:I see missiles as virtually obsolete with injectors in the frame.
One would also have to do something about the cloaking device. Taping '0' twice is faster and cheaper than using the injectors.
Attacking a Navigational Beacon is illegal. Police are on their way.

User avatar
drew
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 2186
Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 9:29 am
Location: In front of a laptop writing a book.
Contact:

Post by drew »

Again, a simple delay as the cloak establishes itself would be good.

Cheers,

Drew.
Author of the Oolite Saga, the officially licensed Elite: Reclamation and Elite Dangerous: Premonition
WebsiteFacebookTwitter

User avatar
aegidian
Master and Commander
Master and Commander
Posts: 1152
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: London UK
Contact:

Post by aegidian »

Mmm.. delayed cloak good, delayed fuel injection mmm.. not so much. I'll look into both options...
"The planet Rear is scourged by well-intentioned OXZs."

Oolite models and gear? click here!

User avatar
ploppy
Mostly Harmless
Mostly Harmless
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 1:04 pm
Location: Australia

Post by ploppy »

It would be wonderful if OXP designers could specify the witchdrive multiplier
for a given craft (like the expanded cargo bay)

or be able to specify the multiplier in the equipment list....

They seem way to fast to me
witchdrive is witchdrive, you either have it or not, something a little more subtle would be nice imho
and add variety

ovvldc
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 344
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2005 9:32 am
Location: Netherlands

Post by ovvldc »

What is the standard multiplier for WFI? In any case, it should not make a craft go FTL :).

Of course, now that at least one of the community people is looking into torpedoes for missiles with WFI the urgency of this feature is a bit reduced.

What might be a good idea is to have the ignition of WFI set the ship speed to maximum first. After all, what would be the point of using WFI when you're running thrusters on idle?

Best wishes,
Oscar

User avatar
Odo987
Dangerous
Dangerous
Posts: 121
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 3:56 am
Location: San Francisco
Contact:

Post by Odo987 »

aegidian wrote:Mmm.. delayed cloak good, delayed fuel injection mmm.. not so much. I'll look into both options...
Sounds good to me. Fuel injectors aren't a get-out-of-jail free card, I've fuel injected straight into missiles. And Police vipers will fuel inject after me, blasting away until I can get a witchspace countdown completed.

The other piece of equipment which needs a delay is the energy bomb. It's instant nature is rather overpowering. One option is to have a three second charge up time. Another option is to have its invisible sphere of destruction expand just like ECM. These options are not mutually exclusive.
Attacking a Navigational Beacon is illegal. Police are on their way.

User avatar
ploppy
Mostly Harmless
Mostly Harmless
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 1:04 pm
Location: Australia

Post by ploppy »

ovvldc wrote:What is the standard multiplier for WFI? In any case, it should not make a craft go FTL :).
I believe from a forum search i did i while ago that it is x7 :shock:

User avatar
Arexack_Heretic
Dangerous Subversive Element
Dangerous Subversive Element
Posts: 1878
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2005 7:32 pm
Location: [%H] = Earth surface, Lattitude 52°10'58.19"N, longtitude 4°30'0.25"E.
Contact:

Post by Arexack_Heretic »

hmm yes. inclusion of multiplier in equipment.plist would allow various grades of injector tech.
also the fuel_burn_factor.

cheap: 3xmaxspeed, 1/2value, lowtech, 5%chance of fuelleak for every 5seconds of continous use.
normal: 7x
hightech: 7xmaxspeed, more fuel efficient, hightech
millitary: 9x, less fuel efficient, tech15.
racing: depends on the type of race intended for, only available at racing-team-shipyards.
(CAN equipment be specified as only available if in certain system or docket at station_name?)
Riding the Rocket!

User avatar
aegidian
Master and Commander
Master and Commander
Posts: 1152
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: London UK
Contact:

Post by aegidian »

Mmm.. good idea that, but I'd tie burn-rate to the throttle multiplier, just to balance things up.

And I'd also introduce accelerated wear on the ship's hull and engine systems resulting from engine stress. Wouldn't it be a shame if the throttle stuck open...? :shock:

I'll noodle on this some.
"The planet Rear is scourged by well-intentioned OXZs."

Oolite models and gear? click here!

User avatar
aegidian
Master and Commander
Master and Commander
Posts: 1152
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: London UK
Contact:

Post by aegidian »

Arexack_Heretic wrote:(CAN equipment be specified as only available if in certain system or docket at station_name?)
No, but that's a good idea.
"The planet Rear is scourged by well-intentioned OXZs."

Oolite models and gear? click here!

User avatar
LittleBear
---- E L I T E ----
---- E L I T E ----
Posts: 2718
Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2006 7:02 pm
Location: I escaped The Labyrinth with the assistance of my fledgling. After many battles, I'm in the Nexus.

Post by LittleBear »

On balancing the Cloak, could it also drain energy a lot more?

To keep game balance against the Cloak, I've given some of my OXP ships an anti-cloaking device, allowing them to jam the player's ability to cloak at all. It was just too easy in an Imperial Courier with Naval and standard Engergy Units! Other NCPs cannot jam the cloak, but your new piece of Equipment (Mark Transponder Scanner) will not work whilst cloaked, so if cloaked you cannot tell the Difference between the ship you are being paid to kill and all the other normal Oolite ships in the system.
My OXPS : The Assassins Guild, Asteroid Storm, The Bank of the Black Monks, Random Hits and Renegade Pirates can be downloaded from the Elite Wiki here.

Post Reply