Mouse control

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Mistiff
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Mouse control

Post by Mistiff »

Hi all :D

Is it possible to implement a mouse control style similar to Microsoft Freelancer one in the future (I'm playing 1.73.4 now)?

In the meanwhile... Is it possible to invert the Y axis in actual mouse control?

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Re: Mouse control

Post by another_commander »

Mistiff wrote:Hi all :D

Is it possible to implement a mouse control style similar to Microsoft Freelancer one in the future (I'm playing 1.73.4 now)?
How exactly does it work with Freelancer? How is it different to what we have?
In the meanwhile... Is it possible to invert the Y axis in actual mouse control?
I'm afraid not at this time.

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Post by DaddyHoggy »

There is already mouse control, but it depends on your OS (and it's not quite Freelancer style)
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Post by Mistiff »

I know there is a mouse control already, but I think it's not that comfortable to me.

The actual Y axis control, similar to an airplane on Earth (UP= nose down; DOWN=nose up), is perfect when using a joystick/joypad, but it results hard to handle when using a mouse, at least to me.

So I thought about a Freelancer style mouse control type. Even if Freelancer has a totally different ship manouvering style, I think its controls could be adapted to Oolite. Things could be like this:

MOUSE UP = nose up
MOUSE DOWN = nose down
MOUSE LEFT = strafe left
MOUSE RIGHT = strafe right
RIGHT MOUSE BUTTON + MOUSE LEFT/RIGHT = roll left/right (usefull in manual docking)
CENTER MOUSE BUTTON = center all axis
MOUSE WHEEL = engine speed
LEFT MOUSE BUTTON = fire

I know that such controls could make the game much easier and something of the original Elite feeling can be lost but, maybe, controls could result faster and more immediate to players without a joypad.

It's just a proposal for an alternative kind of controls (I play with a joypad at the moment) and it could be also implemented simply as a control option (so the player can decide how to control his own ship).

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Post by Gimi »

Mistiff wrote: MOUSE UP = nose up
MOUSE DOWN = nose down
I don't agree with this. This would be completely counter intuitive for me.
I would prefere:

MOUSE FORWARD (UP) = nose down
MOUSE BACKWARDS (DOWN) = nose up

Standard push down/pull up methodology
So the conclusion here is that it would have to be selectable.
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Post by DaddyHoggy »

Gimi wrote:
Mistiff wrote: MOUSE UP = nose up
MOUSE DOWN = nose down
I don't agree with this. This would be completely counter intuitive for me.
I would prefere:

MOUSE FORWARD (UP) = nose down
MOUSE BACKWARDS (DOWN) = nose up

Standard push down/pull up methodology
So the conclusion here is that it would have to be selectable.
Freelancer was basically a FPS in space - so the mouse movement was a way of tracking targets as you blazed away - so you forgot you were flying something and in that context (only) it worked.
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Post by Gimi »

DaddyHoggy wrote:Freelancer was basically a FPS in space - so the mouse movement was a way of tracking targets as you blazed away - so you forgot you were flying something and in that context (only) it worked.
Point taken, and now understand better where this is coming from. Would still argue for making this a choice if it is to change.
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Post by JensAyton »

Yaw/inverted-pitchmouse control does work very well for space shooters, but it also completely changes the character of the game. The fighter-like roll/pitch control, while utterly nonsensical, is the heart of Eliteishness.

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I agree with Mistiff

Post by mcarans »

Hi,

This is my first comment here and I hate to disagree with a Grand Admiral, but I think that the controls laid out my Mistiff would be great to have the option of using.

I played Elite originally on the C64 many years ago so am delighted at this project which brings back fond memories.

I also played Freelancer. Why not make it that in the non-strict mode, the mouse controls are configurable to be like Freelancer? For those who do not have a joystick, this would make gameplay a lot easier. As someone who played the original, I don't think it would spoil the game's Eliteishness. It would make it better.

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Post by Poro »

For many of us who never played the original Elite 'back in the day', the absence of YAW control seems... just wrong somehow. I can see why some like roll/pitch though, it gives more of a dogfighting hunter/prey feel: angling and pitching to keep the enemy in your sights. Yaw/pitch on the other hand gives more of a 'pick your enemy' feel, and is great when you are surrounded by swarms of pirates or Thargoids :D

I've only started playing again because now 1.74 includes Yaw/pitch on the mouse control: I don't have a joystick; I couldn't adapt to roll/pitch; and the keyboard controls were becoming frustrating during heavy fighting, so as long as there is flexibility in the control scheme more and more people will enjoy thing great game!

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Roll with right mouse button <>

Post by mcarans »

The only problem is that it would be nice to be able to choose to invert the current up down - ie. mouse up, nose up, mouse down, nose down

I also like these ideas from Mistiff:
RIGHT MOUSE BUTTON + MOUSE LEFT/RIGHT = roll left/right (useful in manual docking)
CENTRE MOUSE BUTTON = centre all axis
MOUSE WHEEL = engine speed

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Post by DaddyHoggy »

Poro wrote:For many of us who never played the original Elite 'back in the day', the absence of YAW control seems... just wrong somehow. I can see why some like roll/pitch though, it gives more of a dogfighting hunter/prey feel: angling and pitching to keep the enemy in your sights. Yaw/pitch on the other hand gives more of a 'pick your enemy' feel, and is great when you are surrounded by swarms of pirates or Thargoids :D

I've only started playing again because now 1.74 includes Yaw/pitch on the mouse control: I don't have a joystick; I couldn't adapt to roll/pitch; and the keyboard controls were becoming frustrating during heavy fighting, so as long as there is flexibility in the control scheme more and more people will enjoy thing great game!
Huh? Yaw control, both keyboard and stick (if you had the right kind of stick) has been in for, erm, ages - c. 1.70 (possibly even 1.68 )
Last edited by DaddyHoggy on Sun Jun 20, 2010 11:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Sarin »

I gave it a little thinking...the FPS-style of mouse control doesn't suit me, since I usually have to lift and move my mouse back to pad every second or two. The "glide"system, like the one used in Vegastrike, would be much better for maneuvering.

But it is also a lot worse for precise aiming. So I'd propose a hybrid system as an option. Normally, a mouse would be in glide mode, but when a specific key is pressed, the mouse centers and as long as the key is pressed, it woukld be in normal mode for precise aiming.

It's 1.30 AM and I'm probably not explainig it well, but....if you understand what I mean, I think it's wort a try.

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Post by Poro »

DaddyHoggy wrote:
Poro wrote:For many of us who never played the original Elite 'back in the day', the absence of YAW control seems... just wrong somehow. I can see why some like roll/pitch though, it gives more of a dogfighting hunter/prey feel: angling and pitching to keep the enemy in your sights. Yaw/pitch on the other hand gives more of a 'pick your enemy' feel, and is great when you are surrounded by swarms of pirates or Thargoids :D

I've only started playing again because now 1.74 includes Yaw/pitch on the mouse control: I don't have a joystick; I couldn't adapt to roll/pitch; and the keyboard controls were becoming frustrating during heavy fighting, so as long as there is flexibility in the control scheme more and more people will enjoy thing great game!
Huh? Yaw control, both keyboard and stick (if you had the right kind of stick) has been in for, erm, ages - c. 1.70 (possibly even 1.68 )
*Cough*
I've only started playing again because now 1.74 includes Yaw/pitch on the mouse control
... on the mouse control

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Post by DaddyHoggy »

:roll: :oops: Yeh, well, it's late.

Just amazed somebody would stop playing something as good as Oolite because mouse control didn't include yaw, so I guess my brain just ignored that bit.
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