Yes, but how many credits is that?

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PhantorGorth
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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by PhantorGorth » Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:42 am

Massively Locked wrote:Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?
http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/18/business/ ... -discovery
Given the average price for gold in oolite is 37.2 Credits per Kg and that nugget weighs 5.5 Kgs then it would be around 204.6 Credits but as the article says that it might go for up to 30% more than it's gold price then that would be up to around 266 Credits. :-)
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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by JazHaz » Sat Jan 19, 2013 4:06 pm

PhantorGorth wrote:
Massively Locked wrote:Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?
http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/18/business/ ... -discovery
Given the average price for gold in oolite is 37.2 Credits per Kg and that nugget weighs 5.5 Kgs then it would be around 204.6 Credits but as the article says that it might go for up to 30% more than it's gold price then that would be up to around 266 Credits. :-)
Seems cheap to me, considering that nugget is worth A$300,000 (£180,000).

That would make an exchange rate of around A$1,466.28/Cr or £879.77/Cr.
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drew wrote:£4,500 though! :shock: <Faints>
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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by Walbrigg » Sat Jan 19, 2013 4:24 pm

Wheat currently goes for 792.5 cents per bushel, which is 317 dollars per tonne, which puts a credit at about a hundred dollars of current agricultural value.

Gold is 1688.1 dollars a troy ounce, which is 54,000 dollars a kilo, or about 500 credits based on the food price conversion.

So gold in Oolite has fallen in value by a bit over 90% relative to food compared to the present day - pretty much what you would expect to happen if asteroid mining works well.

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by DaddyHoggy » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:45 pm

Walbrigg wrote:Wheat currently goes for 792.5 cents per bushel, which is 317 dollars per tonne, which puts a credit at about a hundred dollars of current agricultural value.

Gold is 1688.1 dollars a troy ounce, which is 54,000 dollars a kilo, or about 500 credits based on the food price conversion.

So gold in Oolite has fallen in value by a bit over 90% relative to food compared to the present day - pretty much what you would expect to happen if asteroid mining works well.
This has been discussed many times over the years - the classic error is that a TC is not a Ton(ne) - it is some special mass/volume designed specifically for space cannisters and their contents.

We're hoping that an Oolite kg is the same as a Earth RL(tm) kg - if we presume it is - then we need to think about what keeps RL(tm) prices high - and that's mainly control of supply, difficulty/cost of extraction, dual purpose (jewellery, electronics) and actual abundance of the material. Here on Earth it has been estimated there is 1000x as much gold dissolved in the world's oceans than has ever been mined.

Given the variety of planets in the Ooniverse, some are bound to be mostly ocean (as per the "unusual/fabled/pink descriptions), formed around stars with high concentrations of gold at creation and, if interstellar space flight is "the norm" then extraction from water (or even advanced mining techniques) should be relatively easy - therefore gold is abundant and therefore relatively "cheap" commodity (one could hypothesise)
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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by Specialist290 » Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:20 am

the classic error is that a TC is not a Ton(ne) - it is some special mass/volume designed specifically for space cannisters and their contents.
That makes me wonder: What, exactly, are the dimensions and volume of an Oolite cargo container? I'm entertaining the notion that they're called 1-Ton(ne) Containers because they're designed to carry that mass of some specific substance that was used as the measuring standard, but to figure out what, exactly, they were designed around, you'd have to work backwards from the volume to find the density.

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by Diziet Sma » Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:10 am

Specialist290 wrote: I'm entertaining the notion that they're called 1-Ton(ne) Containers because they're designed to carry that mass of some specific substance that was used as the measuring standard, but to figure out what, exactly, they were designed around, you'd have to work backwards from the volume to find the density.
I'm guessing it was a Tonne of feathers. Loosely packed. :wink:
Most games have some sort of paddling-pool-and-water-wings beginning to ease you in: Oolite takes the rather more Darwinian approach of heaving you straight into the ocean, often with a brick or two in your pockets for luck. ~ Disembodied

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by Eric Walch » Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:33 am

DaddyHoggy wrote:This has been discussed many times over the years - the classic error is that a TC is not a Ton(ne) - it is some special mass/volume designed specifically for space cannisters and their contents.
Another error is that people compare the ₢ with $ or € in size. It is more likely that the 1 ₢ is about 1000 €. 6 ₢ for a tonne food sounds to cheap, but 6000 € for a ton of food sounds already much better.

In continental Europe we calculate gold in € per kg . At the moment the value is around the 40 000 €/kg. That is than very close to the 37 ₢/kg in Oolite. :D

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by Commander McLane » Thu Feb 14, 2013 9:23 am

Eric Walch wrote:
DaddyHoggy wrote:This has been discussed many times over the years - the classic error is that a TC is not a Ton(ne) - it is some special mass/volume designed specifically for space cannisters and their contents.
Another error is that people compare the ₢ with $ or € in size. It is more likely that the 1 ₢ is about 1000 €. 6 ₢ for a tonne food sounds to cheap, but 6000 € for a ton of food sounds already much better.
But this makes of course the 2.4 ₢ that you're charged for a drink in a Seedy Space Bar outrageous. :wink:

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by cim » Thu Feb 14, 2013 9:28 am

Commander McLane wrote:But this makes of course the 2.4 ₢ that you're charged for a drink in a Seedy Space Bar outrageous. :wink:
It was a pretty outrageous markup anyway, since you can sell them a TC for around 40-50 ₢, and you're presumably not consuming your entire weight in drink...

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by Commander McLane » Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:27 am

cim wrote:
Commander McLane wrote:But this makes of course the 2.4 ₢ that you're charged for a drink in a Seedy Space Bar outrageous. :wink:
It was a pretty outrageous markup anyway, since you can sell them a TC for around 40-50 ₢, and you're presumably not consuming your entire weight in drink...
Well, of course it was never so much about the drink itself as about the hot Fierce Black Horned Feline who serves it to you. :wink:

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by maik » Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:30 am

Commander McLane wrote:
cim wrote:
Commander McLane wrote:But this makes of course the 2.4 ₢ that you're charged for a drink in a Seedy Space Bar outrageous. :wink:
It was a pretty outrageous markup anyway, since you can sell them a TC for around 40-50 ₢, and you're presumably not consuming your entire weight in drink...
Well, of course it was never so much about the drink itself as about the hot Fierce Black Horned Feline who serves it to you. :wink:
Which puts more emphasis on seedy than on bar :D

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by Rorschachhamster » Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:31 am

And the prices in places like that... :shock: .. at least, I heard that. :oops: :lol:

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by ZygoUgo » Thu Feb 14, 2013 3:05 pm

*Blah*
I decided personally that the original volume/weight of cannisters was according to the kg weight/volume of platinum, as 1000kg of it makes up the tonne and is cannistered, so other products would just be according as to how much of it physically fits into this standardised and universally scoopable unit, each one being a 'ton'.
It also makes sense to me, what with the mention of asteroid mining, would that not be the first form of space trade, and then even more likely that platinum would form the bench mark?
And thirdly, platinum as loaded by the tonne would form a manageably sized cannister allowing for scoops to be fitted to most vessels of a reasonable size.
*Blah*

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Re: Yes, but how many credits is that?

Post by Commander McLane » Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:53 pm

Specialist290 wrote:What, exactly, are the dimensions and volume of an Oolite cargo container?
Well, the core Oolite cargo container has the shape of a regular pentagon with a side length of 3.6m and a depth of 9.6m. This gives it a total volume of 3.6^2 * 1.720477400588967 square meters * 9.6m = 214.054916271676949 cubic meters, which is more than three times the volume of a standard 40 ft container (67 cubic meters).

Which makes the assumption below rather doubtful:
ZygoUgo wrote:I decided personally that the original volume/weight of cannisters was according to the kg weight/volume of platinum, as 1000kg of it makes up the tonne and is cannistered, so other products would just be according as to how much of it physically fits into this standardised and universally scoopable unit, each one being a 'ton'.
(Obvious disclaimer: sizes make as much sense in Oolite as weights: none at all; so the point is rather academic.)

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